Sean Payton’s Hubris, and His Relationship With Mike Ornstein, Are at the Center of Saints’ Bounty Scandal
Hubris–this bounty scandal is ultimately about the hubris of the Saints organization, keyed by their head coach, Sean Payton. You may hear talk that this stuff happens all over the league. That’s like the guy who was running guns in a trunk claiming he wasn’t the only one speeding, so why did you pull him over? Yes, players have thrown money in pools in probably every locker room in the league, a kangaroo court that pays out for big plays, fumbles forced, and big hits. And yes, there have no doubt been games where a specific bounty was set on a player for a perceived slight or because of his actions in a previous game.
This is different, though, in its scope, its persistence, and in the organizational approval that came from the men in charge. Jeff Duncan of the Times-Picayune thinks that the Saints are in trouble not just because they were caught in this, but because of the persistent flaunting of the league rules.
They’ve openly mocked the league’s media policy since Payton took control, including intentionally being more than an hour late to Media Day at Super Bowl XLIV. A 2010 lawsuit by the Saints’ former director of security, Geoff Santini, accused Loomis of trying to cover up the theft of the prescription painkiller Vicodin by members of the football staff. The front office also ignored league directives to disassociate themselves with convicted felon Mike Ornstein, who – surprise, surprise – was also implicated in the bounty scandal.
Ah, yes, that painkiller episode where Sean Payton was alleged to have stolen Vicodin from the team facility. Nothing has come from that–at this point. I suspect that wound has been scratched now and everything will get greater scrutiny in New Orleans. Then there is Mike Ornstein, who will play an integral role in this case going forward, and why this isn’t just about paying a few players to get some big, potentially illegal hits.
From Mike Freeman yesterday, Ornstein was involved in sending e-mails to Sean Payton in both 2009 and 2011 regarding putting in money toward the bounty program for taking out quarterbacks. The NFL has its paper trail, and it ties this to other bad behavior, and ties Sean Payton to having direct knowledge. How do you have written emails and documentation of a bounty program where people, like big donors at major universities, are kicking in money on the side? Hubris.
If you do not know Mike Ornstein, well, he came to the Saints’ attention as the marketing agent for Reggie Bush. He was intimately involved with the Saints in their Super Bowl run in 2009, so much so that Sean Payton credited him for a lot of work behind the scenes. Some of that work, as it turns out, also involved in contributing funds for bounties. Ornstein was such a great guy all around that he was popped on federal charges for scalping tickets, and served jail time. Payton sure tried to downplay their relationship soon after that news came out; you would not know they were e-mail buddies.
How does a now convicted felon, with part of that arising out of tickets from the Super Bowl, end up back on the sideline this December? Hubris. How does he end up sending more e-mails, leaving more of a paper trail, while jumping right back into the quarterback injury bounty game, after serving jail time? Hubris.
This is about just a few bounties like the Watergate scandal was just about a break-in. When the news first broke yesterday, I thought this would be a story and their would be minor punishment, everyone would pretend that players don’t try to hit hard all the time, and we move on. Now, though, I think it is going to be a major deal, and several people are going to pay steep penalties, and not just with a small fine and a few games being suspended. Just like Al Capone was popped for tax evasion, the entry point on the Saints’ penalties from the NFL is the salary cap and league violations, with team officials knowing and administering who earned the equivalent of bonuses.
While there is talk about Gregg Williams’ bounty program in Washington, I suspect it was nowhere near what it turned into in New Orleans. It took an explosive combination of Williams’ willingness to push players to the limits of legality and Sean Payton’s hubris. This isn’t just happening everywhere in the league.
[photo via cantstopthebleeding.com]

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45 Responses to “Sean Payton’s Hubris, and His Relationship With Mike Ornstein, Are at the Center of Saints’ Bounty Scandal”
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March 3rd, 2012 at 1:54 PM
Far worse than Spygate and I’m not even a Pats fan.
March 3rd, 2012 at 2:02 PM
One wonders if this might get Payton and Loomis out of the bayou and Bill Cowher in?
March 3rd, 2012 at 2:05 PM
A whole lot of hubris up in here.
March 3rd, 2012 at 2:08 PM
Not worse than Spygate, in that it produced no competitive advantage. But worse from a moral standpoint.
March 3rd, 2012 at 2:15 PM
If you succeed in maiming the other team I’d say it does…they’re not doing that entirely for fun
March 3rd, 2012 at 2:20 PM
Yeah, but the bounty doesn’t actually create the advantage. If you clothesline a guy, the refs can call it.
March 3rd, 2012 at 2:26 PM
Yeah, but the bounty doesn’t actually create the advantage.
Offering $1500 to a millionaire to do what he really wants to do anyway isn’t much of a financial advantage. I think of it more as a teammate building exercise. However, I am not a millionaire. Offer me $1500 to concuss Kurt Warner and I’m on the first Greyhound bus to Phoenix.
March 3rd, 2012 at 2:27 PM
I don’t think so. The Saints’ malfeasance happened on the field, so it was still restricted by the rules of play. Spygate was off the field, where there was no oversight and thus no inherent limitation to the extent of their rule breaking.
March 3rd, 2012 at 2:31 PM
Ugh. More examination of what is actually known, less armchair psycho-analysis.
March 3rd, 2012 at 2:31 PM
Can’t wait to see what Gregggggggg Easterbrook has to say about this.
March 3rd, 2012 at 2:37 PM
That’s like the guy who was running guns in a trunk claiming he wasn’t the only one speeding, so why did you pull him over?
slick move, avoiding a racism problem by having “gun runners” profiled by the cops instead of drug runners.
March 3rd, 2012 at 2:37 PM
tend to agree with this, but worried the league will back down because everyone seems to be afraid to mean to New Orleans because of post Katrina. But I think they should be absolutely hammered for this. Multiple game suspensions for Payton, multiple picks taken away, big fines for team, Loomis, and Payton. And Greggggg should be shit-canned in STL and fined heavily and banned from league for minimum year
March 3rd, 2012 at 2:40 PM
Loomis, Payton & Williams should get 2-year suspensions (can be negotiated to 1 year), 500k to org, loss of a 2nd rounder. Ornstein, lifetime ban from NFL sites.
March 3rd, 2012 at 2:42 PM
More examination of what is actually known, less armchair psycho-analysis.
I just learned a bunch of things I didn’t know. And I’ve been reading about this all day. I’m glad somebody else read and distilled Mike Freeman for me, so I don’t have to do that myself.
March 3rd, 2012 at 2:42 PM
Multiple game suspensions for Payton, multiple picks taken away, big fines for team, Loomis, and Payton. And Greggggg should be shit-canned in STL and fined heavily and banned from league for minimum year
I’d add that he needs to be chemically castrated, but you can’t chemically castrate an old lesbian.
March 3rd, 2012 at 2:43 PM
Donte Stallworth thinks this is excessive.
March 3rd, 2012 at 2:43 PM
Ornstein, lifetime ban from NFL sites.
and email. He can no longer email anybody.
March 3rd, 2012 at 2:51 PM
Loomis, Payton & Williams should get 2-year suspensions (can be negotiated to 1 year)
Donte Stallworth thinks this is excessive.
From a labor perspective Donte is in NFLPA with tons of legalese on his side, whereas the members of team mgmt for a franchise have much labor protection at all. This is going to cripple the franchise. Loomis is going to have to be fired. But when, wait til the draft and Brees negotiation are over? Let somebody new come in and make the decisions on their UFA? Internal promos (but they could be tainted by the scandal too.
Saints Franchise is FECKED.
March 3rd, 2012 at 3:01 PM
HARUMPH!
March 3rd, 2012 at 3:04 PM
Lisk just doesn’t do high-horsed finger wagging like Huffy Puffy does. I mean nice effort, but put Hubris into Thesaurus.com and then tie it into Shakespeare or something.
March 3rd, 2012 at 3:07 PM
NBC Golf – 2 bear trap mentions in first minute of broadcast. “Overflowing galleries” mentioned while they show a half-barren course. Should be an entertaining broadcast… wIth the mute button applied.
March 3rd, 2012 at 3:19 PM
“Overflowing galleries”
Reminds me of Wednesday night when Mizzou couldn’t even sell out Paige Arena for Senior Night. This is the best damn Mizzou team in 30 years and they have a ton of Seniors that have won more games in their career than any senior class prior. They’ll fit in fine in the SEC for basketball.
March 3rd, 2012 at 3:21 PM
A day later and I think everyone in NOLA is expecting the hammer to come down: major fines for the team, Loomis, Payton and the players; suspensions for Loomis and Payton; loss of at least 1-2 draft picks this year and our first next year.
We still have those who’ll defend the team and ride/die with it in spite of the evidence. But most are coming around to the simple fact that, regardless of whether or not it happens everywhere else, we’re now going to be made the poster boys of bounty hunting and made to pay for it.
Aside: think that other teams aren’t burning all evidence of their bounty programs as we speak??
March 3rd, 2012 at 3:22 PM
Didn’t Vilma throw down $10k on a table? that’s cash money, homey. they would do it in a cocaine heartbeat.
and I don’t know what the punishments from the league should be, but I think Benson is going to have to fire Payton.
March 3rd, 2012 at 3:26 PM
The Saints knowingly allowed this to happen. The payments, because of this knowledge of the bounty program and endorsed bu the coaching staff and management, is a major penalty of the salary cap, even if the payments were small. Look at what the NBA did to the T-Wolves…loss of picks for 5 years, suspension for McHale and a 3.5 million dollar fine. Goodell will lay the hammer and it won’t be pretty when he’s done.
March 3rd, 2012 at 3:27 PM
We still have those who’ll defend the team and ride/die with it in spite of the evidence BFFredo
Are you speaking of Breesus?
Didn’t Vilma throw down $10k on a table? that’s cash money, homey. they would do it in a cocaine heartbeat. Oskie
No clue. This is the most I’ve read on this all week. I didn’t think it was much of a story. I just saw somewhere that $1500 was the reward for something. Give me $10K and I’d be on the first Greyhound bus to sex up Warner’s wife. Maybe. Somewhere around Gallup, NM, I may ask that the pot be sweetened.
March 3rd, 2012 at 3:30 PM
KC- i just think that money is money to these guys. helps cover the fines they may receive.
March 3rd, 2012 at 3:33 PM
We still have those who’ll defend the team and ride/die with it in spite of the evidence
Are you speaking of Breesus?
Not just him, but many countless others.
The Saints knowingly allowed this to happen. The payments, because of this knowledge of the bounty program and endorsed bu the coaching staff and management
This is the thing that burns them: not the amounts or whether or not it violated the CBA rules regarding bonuses. Quite simply, the people who are supposed to know better and stop it didn’t. Akin to CFB scandals like Ohio State’s tatts — it’s bad if you don’t know but it’s worse to know and do nothing about it.
March 3rd, 2012 at 3:35 PM
Oskie – You might be right. I probably shouldn’t speak for millionaire athletes. That $1500/$10K that isn’t taxed might pay off a baby momma for a week. Or a night at the strip club.
March 3rd, 2012 at 3:52 PM
One wonders if this might get Payton and Loomis out of the bayou and Bill Cowher in
brees could leave and maybe in shamel any player who knew of this and didn’t blow a whistle is part of this
he may not want to stick around a proigram that might be gutted by fines, suspensions and lost draft picks
March 3rd, 2012 at 3:52 PM
One wonders if this might get Payton and Loomis out of the bayou and Bill Cowher in
brees could leave and maybe in shamel any player who knew of this and didn’t blow a whistle is part of this
he may not want to stick around a proigram that might be gutted by fines, suspensions and lost draft picks
March 3rd, 2012 at 3:53 PM
The fact that the Saints had a bounty system isn’t why they are in trouble. The fact that they were told to knock it off and then just went ahead with it anyway is why they are in trouble. If other teams have bounty systems, and I’m sure they do, unless they were told by the NFL to squash it and did nothing at all to squash it there isn’t a comparison to be made. Of course, I’ve only seen that excuse thrown up as a roadblock to that theoretical excuse being made. I haven’t actually seen or read anybody saying, “No fair! Other teams do it, too!”
March 3rd, 2012 at 3:56 PM
i mean it
March 3rd, 2012 at 3:59 PM
but stark and anyone else, how is this different than paying some punk 1k to kneecap someone you don’t like? i said it yesterday and i say it today…this is criminal
March 3rd, 2012 at 5:08 PM
This is about just a few bounties like the Watergate scandal was just about a break-in. When the news first broke yesterday, I thought this would be a story and their would be minor punishment, everyone would pretend that players don’t try to hit hard all the time, and we move on.
Ugh. Really? This is supposed to be a site now owned by Gannett. Something like this should not slip past editors. Seriously. English 101. Their, there and they’re are three different things. And if you don’t know that by now, find another way to make the point.
March 3rd, 2012 at 6:03 PM
The manipulation of the salary cap, depending where exactly the money came from, is a bigger deal, as far as competitive advantage goes. As for Spygate, why can we not make it one freaking comment without comparing two completely different and unrelated events.
I’m giving Lisk all my unused +1s for the week, just for having the ability to write this post and not mentioning Spygate or the Pats one.
March 3rd, 2012 at 6:05 PM
I’m pretty well known as being the one most critical of this shit, especially by authors, but I’d give Lisk a pass. It’s a weekend post, and he has like a million kids. There probably wasn’t much of an editorial process.
March 3rd, 2012 at 6:50 PM
Agree with this plus the fact that Lisk has a strong track record on both content and grammar.
March 3rd, 2012 at 7:42 PM
I would agree mostly regarding Lisk, who is the best writer on the site, but it is English 101. A weekend post and having a million kids should not excuse him from knowing the difference. Call me the grammar police if you will, but this stuff really gets my goat, so to speak.
March 3rd, 2012 at 10:09 PM
Hey wwos..i have as many kids as lisk and….wait you never criticize me…never mind
March 4th, 2012 at 1:30 PM
You have twins though… it basically only counts as one kid.
/waits to get slapped by every* woman with kids here
*none, I think
March 4th, 2012 at 1:30 PM
Who the fuck are you? If you start talking about p-values next, we’re gonna have an issue.
/flexes
March 4th, 2012 at 10:29 PM
I’m pretty well known as being the one most critical of this shit, especially by authors, but I’d give Lisk a pass. It’s a weekend post, and he has like a million kids. There probably wasn’t much of an editorial process.
Agree with this plus the fact that Lisk has a strong track record on both content and grammar.
And a strong record on births too!
BTW, I don’t think the CBA allegations will matter. Off-the-books bonuses/payments occur all the time — whether it’s one player buying his number from another or a QB buying his linemen $50K watches for covering his ass. None of that is factored into the official bonus programs either and it’s allowed and publicized by the NFL.
The NFL will make this about how this violated the NFL’s policies and try to keep it in house.
March 5th, 2012 at 11:09 AM
Editor?
Whoa. This is over-the-top. It’s obviously a very bad thing. And, without ever excusing it, it’s been in the league for a long time. And, Payton should be hammered by this. But, fired? And bring in Cowher? That would simply guarantee they’d never win a title, ever. Payton/Brees have made this team relevant.
March 5th, 2012 at 11:12 AM
/counts pubris