Comparing the Green Bay Packers to Other 8-0 Teams: The Defense Keeps Them Near the Bottom
When you start 8-0, you get to be compared with more lofty company. Many teams start 6-0, but only 13 other teams have survived to 8-0 since the league went to the 16 game schedule in 1978. Most people think that the Packers are the clearly best team in the league, and it’s just a question of when the coronation will occur. My thoughts haven’t changed much since I wrote this about it being too early to talk undefeated with this particular team, and the Packers have since won games over Minnesota by 6 and the Chargers by 7.
I went through the 14 teams (including Green Bay) who started 8-0, and looked at 10 different categories: points scored, points allowed, point difference, turnover margin, yardage margin, net passing yards per play on offense, net passing yards per play on defense, yards per carry on offense, yards per carry on defense, and strength of schedule (opponent win percentage after 8 games). I rank-ordered each team from 1-14 in each category, and tallied the totals. Here are the 8-0 teams in order of their strength across all categories, relative to each other.
- 2007 New England Patriots – Lost Super Bowl
- 1991 Washington Redskins – Won Super Bowl
- 1984 Miami Dolphins - Lost Super Bowl
- 1985 Chicago Bears – Won Super Bowl
- 2009 New Orleans Saints – Won Super Bowl
- 1998 Denver Broncos – Won Super Bowl
- 1990 New York Giants – Won Super Bowl
- 2005 Indianapolis Colts – Lost in Divisional Playoffs
- 2008 Tennessee Titans – Lost in in Divisional Playoffs
- 2003 Kansas City Chiefs – Lost in Divisional Playoffs
- 2009 Indianapolis Colts – Lost Super Bowl
- 2011 Green Bay Packers – ?
- 1990 San Francisco 49ers – Lost in NFC Championship Game
- 2006 Indianapolis Colts – Won Super Bowl
You may think this is meaningless, but if we cut this list in half, the top 7 teams all reached the Super Bowl and 5 of them won. The bottom half? Of the other 6 teams, only two of them reached a Super Bowl, with the 2006 Colts the only one to win, after going 4-4 down the stretch in the regular season. Dominance matters.
The Packers rank #1 in net passing yards per play on offense, just ahead of 1984 Miami and 2007 New England. They are also near the top in points scored as a result. They are average or below average in most other categories, including dead last by a substantial margin in pass defense and points allowed, and ahead of only the 2008 Titans in yardage difference.
What if, rather than looking at overall strength across several categories, we try to find the teams most similar to the way that the Packers are doing it. Using the absolute value difference in each category, here are the 8-0 teams ordered from most to least similar to this year’s Packers.
- 1984 Miami Dolphins
- 2009 New Orleans Saints
- 2006 Indianapolis Colts
- 2003 Kansas City Chiefs
- 2007 New England Patriots
- 2005 Indianapolis Colts
- 1998 Denver Broncos
- 2009 Indianapolis Colts
- 1990 New York Giants
- 2008 Tennessee Titans
- 1990 San Francisco 49ers
- 1991 Washington Redskins
- 1985 Chicago Bears
No team is truly similar to the Packers of 2011. The pass defense numbers are so far below any other team that started 8-0 it is stunning. The 2009 Saints are the only team on this list that even finished the season allowing barely more than 6.0 net yards per pass. The Packers are currently at 7.1.
The teams that show up near the top of the similar list are other top passing teams, all of whom had a better pass defense. The lower yardage difference totals is also what boosts the 2006 Colts and the 2003 Chiefs up the similarity list. It’s no surprise that the 1985 Bears show up as the most opposite team to this year’s Packers.
While the common perception that this year’s Packers team is the clear favorite to win the Super Bowl, the pass defense is historically bad for a unit to win a Super Bowl. It’s a bit of a surprise given how good they were last year, and maybe they can turn it around as a result, though each passing week raises more flags.
Kerry Byrne of Cold Hard Football Facts states that the Packers are on pace to have the best passer rating differential (offensive passer rating minus defensive passer rating allowed) since Unitas. Here’s the problem with that: it’s comparing end of season figures to the Packers at the halfway point. It also includes interceptions, which are very explanatory, but not as predictive. The more predictive portion of the passer rating–the yards per attempt part, doesn’t bode as well for the defense. Rodgers has thrown only 4 interceptions on 266 attempts, and the defense has 16 interceptions on 319 passes.
IF the Packers continue those interception rates, then sure, they will rank near the top in pass efficiency when we look back and explain why they won. Rodgers, who is playing at a high level, can still have games where the ball gets tipped, or batted, or deflected, and see that turnover number turn. Even more likely, they won’t continue picking off over 5% of the passes thrown at them, particularly when they have been giving up big chunks of yards. If those numbers regress, they will see that differential plummet as the interception portion normalizes.
If we strip away the turnovers, and look at the more predictive net yardage, the difference between the Packers’ offense and Packers passing defense is in the bottom half of the 8-0 teams.
Green Bay has been dominant to get to 8-0 in part because of the turnovers in the passing game, and Rodgers’ efficiency. Compared to the other 8-0 teams, though, they look far from unbeatable. All those 8-0 teams, by the way, averaged 5.7 wins over the second half of the season. Still too early.
[photo via Getty]

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102 Responses to “Comparing the Green Bay Packers to Other 8-0 Teams: The Defense Keeps Them Near the Bottom”
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November 10th, 2011 at 3:13 PM
1991 Washington Redskins – Won Super Bowl
boom, shake shake shake the room!
November 10th, 2011 at 3:14 PM
Wait, a real post today?
/kazoo
November 10th, 2011 at 3:15 PM
49ers lost the NFC title game to the Giants.
November 10th, 2011 at 3:16 PM
I stopped here. My saddest point in sports, after spending the whole year listening to everyone call my favorite team a bunch of cheaters.
Gotta think this improves, considering the personnel they have, right?
November 10th, 2011 at 3:17 PM
Im sure they’ll go at least 14-2. Playoffs are another story though.
November 10th, 2011 at 3:17 PM
Did Denver not go 8-0 the year the lost to Jacksonville and NE went to the Superbowl?
November 10th, 2011 at 3:18 PM
/nope started 12-1
November 10th, 2011 at 3:19 PM
/belt
November 10th, 2011 at 3:19 PM
They need to rush the passer better, Mike Neal supposed to start practicing today…he’s the guy who was supposed to replace Cullen Jenkins but is never healthy, could be this year’s James Starks coming in late and making a difference
November 10th, 2011 at 3:20 PM
so they’ll have a 20 point loss this year?
/Pats v Browns 2010
November 10th, 2011 at 3:20 PM
So what I take from this is that Green Bay has a very good offense and has been somewhat lucky on defense.
November 10th, 2011 at 3:21 PM
I stopped here. My saddest point in sports, after spending the whole year listening to everyone call my favorite team a bunch of cheaters.
Jesus. Cry me a river.
November 10th, 2011 at 3:22 PM
No, lost week 4 to KC, finished 13-3. That Jacksonville game still makes me want to throw up.
1997 they started 6-0 before losing to the Raiders, went 12-4 and were a wildcard because KC went 13-3. Exacted revenge on Jacksonville to the tune of 42-17. Won Super Bowl over Packers.
1998 they started 14-0 before losing to the Giants, went 14-2. Won Super Bowl over Falcons.
/remembering glory years
November 10th, 2011 at 3:22 PM
I’m just housing the 2nd sandwich that I bought at lunch today and was saving for tomorrow. It’s glorious.
November 10th, 2011 at 3:23 PM
see, i would be OK with a Patriots/Packers Super Bowl, if only to have a 63-60 overtime game with over 1200 yards passing between the teams.
November 10th, 2011 at 3:24 PM
Since that is far too much info to read, is there any credence to the idea that their defensive numbers are skewed since they are so often ahead and teams are passing so much? I’ll hang up and listen for your answer.
November 10th, 2011 at 3:25 PM
I stopped here. My saddest point in sports, after spending the whole year listening to everyone call my favorite team a bunch of cheaters.
You’re breaking my fucking heart WWoS.
November 10th, 2011 at 3:25 PM
I’m just housing the 2nd sandwich that I bought at lunch today and was saving for tomorrow. It’s glorious.
I had deli-sliced cajun turkey in my sandwich today. It was even better than I expected it to be.
November 10th, 2011 at 3:25 PM
oooooh what kind? I’m hungry.
November 10th, 2011 at 3:26 PM
They give up way too many big plays. But, If they can keep a lead and not have to chase a lead I’m sure they’ll be fine.
November 10th, 2011 at 3:26 PM
You’re breaking my fucking heart WWoS.
Imagine if that had happened 2 months after the Astros won their 2nd title in 4 years too. THE HORROR!
November 10th, 2011 at 3:27 PM
I know it’s not the norm lately, but the Packers walk into the Super Bowl if they get HFA. Saints, Falcons, and Lions won’t do it outdoors in January. The Giants won’t do it again because GB doesn’t have a QB who will give them the game in OT. And the 49ers just aren’t ready for that environment.
November 10th, 2011 at 3:28 PM
I finished most of a gallon of chocolate chip cookie dough ice cream in my house last night after swearing I was just going to have one bowl of ice cream.
I simultaneously felt terrible and awesome.
November 10th, 2011 at 3:29 PM
They’ll be 10-1 in exactly two weeks.
November 10th, 2011 at 3:29 PM
I agree
November 10th, 2011 at 3:29 PM
I know it’s not the norm lately, but the Packers walk into the Super Bowl if they get HFA
I’d rather they play on the road in nice weather or in a Dome.
November 10th, 2011 at 3:31 PM
They did have huge leads often. But if the Saints do ANYTHING but run Ingram up the middle, the Chargers remember that they are the Chargers, and the Vikings remember that they are the Vikings, they’re not necessarily 8-0.
/and I won’t even bring up Johnny Knox’s punt return
November 10th, 2011 at 3:31 PM
Rypien Baby!!!
November 10th, 2011 at 3:32 PM
They’ve given up opening drive TDs in half their games so they’re bad regardless of score
November 10th, 2011 at 3:32 PM
/peeks head in
//affirms that WWoS made some stupid comment about 2007
///leaves
November 10th, 2011 at 3:32 PM
I’m just housing the 2nd sandwich that I bought at lunch today and was saving for tomorrow. It’s glorious.
that’s my move. well played.
November 10th, 2011 at 3:32 PM
Seriously? I remember what they did in the Georgia Dome.
November 10th, 2011 at 3:33 PM
Rypien Baby!!!
why the hell can’t we stumble on another version of him?
November 10th, 2011 at 3:34 PM
Grilled chicken bacon wrap. A departure from my normal italian, but it was great.
November 10th, 2011 at 3:34 PM
Seriously? I remember what they did in the Georgia Dome.
Torch the Falcons? That’s kind of my point. Rodgers has said he hates the cold, and the Packers are built like a “dome team.” I’d rather Rodgers sling his lasers in a comfortable environment. Once they’re up 14-0, crowd’s not going to matter much anyway.
November 10th, 2011 at 3:36 PM
Lisk, thanks for bringing normalcy to the blog’s proceedings. Huzzah to you, sir.
November 10th, 2011 at 3:37 PM
/confirmed by control+F
//congrats, all!
November 10th, 2011 at 3:39 PM
motherfucker that was the wrong paste. was supposed to be for the ‘normalcy’ comment.
November 10th, 2011 at 3:39 PM
I applaud this.
November 10th, 2011 at 3:40 PM
WHAT IS IT WITH YOU AND THE FUCKING SANDWICHES?
November 10th, 2011 at 3:40 PM
Once they’re in Atlanta
up 14-0, crowd’s not going to matter much anyway.November 10th, 2011 at 3:40 PM
He ran out of apple pie?
November 10th, 2011 at 3:41 PM
eating tomorrow’s lunch…TODAY!
/slogan’d
November 10th, 2011 at 3:42 PM
mmmmmmm, italian. A toasted italian is my #1 i think. cubans are a close second.
/no homo
November 10th, 2011 at 3:46 PM
WHAT IS IT WITH YOU AND THE FUCKING SANDWICHES?
He ran out of apple pie?
I believe he was making a Bad Santa reference.
November 10th, 2011 at 3:47 PM
Since that is far too much info to read, is there any credence to the idea that their defensive numbers are skewed since they are so often ahead and teams are passing so much? I’ll hang up and listen for your answer.
no
/easy to read
November 10th, 2011 at 3:47 PM
This is funny.
QBs that ugly don’t fall out of trees — or wait, maybe they do. Explains some stuff.
November 10th, 2011 at 3:48 PM
Lisk, give me a score for this weekend’s game. You know you want to.
November 10th, 2011 at 3:50 PM
I hate that these gravatars are so small. Lisk, is that Horshack?
November 10th, 2011 at 3:51 PM
Her name is Fred and there’s a surprise down below for you.
November 10th, 2011 at 3:51 PM
fatty.
November 10th, 2011 at 3:53 PM
I hate that these gravatars are so small. Lisk, is that Horshack?
What are you saying about my appearance?
/(yes, it’s Horshack)
November 10th, 2011 at 3:53 PM
Grilled chicken bacon wrap
puts on menu of execution day last meal
November 10th, 2011 at 3:53 PM
it’s like a gd funeral home in here sometimes.
November 10th, 2011 at 3:55 PM
Damn, I alwasy assumed that was you
November 10th, 2011 at 3:56 PM
I see a butterfly.
November 10th, 2011 at 3:56 PM
I think a team like the Giants and maybe Niners could compete with GB in a cold weather environment, which could actually hurt the Packers passing game. A team that can use a ball control offense to also keep Rodgers possessions at a minimum.
November 10th, 2011 at 3:57 PM
you ain’t gonna shit right for a week.
November 10th, 2011 at 3:58 PM
I hate that these gravatars are so small. Lisk, is that Horshack?
I see a butterfly.
Is that a Rorschach joke?
November 10th, 2011 at 3:59 PM
i’ve decided to be a bears fan
what do i do next?
November 10th, 2011 at 3:59 PM
I find this to be untrue. Passing numbers in the snow aren’t that much different than good weather, aren’t they? I certainly remember Tom Brady carving up a few teams (cough, Titans, cough) in some pretty heavy snow.
Wind on the other hand…
November 10th, 2011 at 3:59 PM
I’m usually a fan of toasted subs, but you get a nice prosciutto, salami, and capicciola on a crusty italian bread? Keep it away from a toaster, that’s good eatin.
November 10th, 2011 at 4:00 PM
Only for poopy quarterbacks
/looks at Eli
November 10th, 2011 at 4:00 PM
I agree with your point but I also did mean cold, windy, possible snowy weather.
November 10th, 2011 at 4:01 PM
Well it’s not a Bad Santa reference…
November 10th, 2011 at 4:02 PM
kill yourself
November 10th, 2011 at 4:02 PM
I know it has more to do with the team they played, but last year GB carved up Atlanta in the dome, and it came down to the end in Philly and in Chicago. Also, as stated, Rodgers says he is not a fan of the cold weather.
November 10th, 2011 at 4:02 PM
Well it’s not a Bad Santa reference…
That’s unfortunate. That movie is highly quotable.
November 10th, 2011 at 4:02 PM
I resisted. His SB MVP is a joke, but he talked shit on Brady, then beat him in New England. I can’t say anything on him.
On the other hand, how many games has Peyton won this year? Yeah… fuck you, Peyton!
November 10th, 2011 at 4:03 PM
Is that a Will Ferrell movie? I don’t watch anything he’s in.
November 10th, 2011 at 4:04 PM
Hell no!!! Its a Billy Bob Thornton masterpiece.
November 10th, 2011 at 4:04 PM
Like the Pats/Bears game from last year?
November 10th, 2011 at 4:05 PM
I understand the individual words you are saying but I cannot grasp the meaning of them together.
November 10th, 2011 at 4:05 PM
Fuck me Santa Fuck me Santa!!!
/Never looked at Lauren Graham the same after that
November 10th, 2011 at 4:05 PM
Who hasn’t seen bad santa? You’re fuckin with me.
November 10th, 2011 at 4:05 PM
short term memory does that, in the long run you’ll be able to say whatever you want.
November 10th, 2011 at 4:08 PM
Well it’s not a Bad Santa reference…
That’s unfortunate. That movie is highly quotable.
are you sayin’ my gear don’t work?
November 10th, 2011 at 4:08 PM
I don’t watch many movies… I go to maybe one a year in the theater, sometimes not even that. And my Netflix is usually just TV shows.
The only movie I’ve watched in the last two months was The Magnificent Seven with Steve McQueen and Yul Brynner
November 10th, 2011 at 4:09 PM
Is that a Will Ferrell movie? I don’t watch anything he’s in.
Holy shit, please see this movie right away.
November 10th, 2011 at 4:09 PM
Gear as in sexual? MY FUCKSTICK?!?!
November 10th, 2011 at 4:11 PM
And no, it’s Billy Bob Thornton, Bernie Mac, the delectable (and SMU alum) Lauren Graham, Lauren Tom, and John Ritter in his last movie role.
November 10th, 2011 at 4:12 PM
bad santa is one of the funniest movies i’ve ever seen. its a must see. i believe comedy central plays this for 24 hours to combat the retarded movie TBS shows.
/i refuse to say the name of the movie
November 10th, 2011 at 4:12 PM
Gear as in sexual? MY FUCKSTICK?!?!
he’s not going to say “fuck stick” in front of the children, is he?!?!?
November 10th, 2011 at 4:12 PM
Is that a Will Ferrell movie? I don’t watch anything he’s in.
no anchorman in your life?
/condolences
November 10th, 2011 at 4:14 PM
bad santa is one of the funniest movies i’ve ever seen. its a must see. i believe comedy central plays this for 24 hours to combat the retarded movie TBS shows.
/i refuse to say the name of the movie
I’m sorry, but are you shit-talking A Christmas Story? Because that is simply not acceptable. That movie is a classic.
November 10th, 2011 at 4:14 PM
Okay okay okay. If it sucks though… well… I don’t have anything I can threaten with, but I’ll move you down a couple ranks in my list of invisible friends.
November 10th, 2011 at 4:14 PM
the delectable (and SMU alum) Lauren Graham
November 10th, 2011 at 4:15 PM
I saw it in the theatre, and during the beginning with Billy Bob is puking outside of a bar in a santa suit i hear this little voice in the audience say “Daddy, why is Santa sick? Is he going to be OK?”
a guy brought his son, looked to be no less than 8 years to see Bad Santa.
November 10th, 2011 at 4:15 PM
No man, Bad Santa is a movie you have to see unedited.
November 10th, 2011 at 4:15 PM
it was made it Cleveland. All I got.
November 10th, 2011 at 4:15 PM
I’m sorry, but are you shit-talking A Christmas Story? Because that is simply not acceptable. That movie is a classic.
i FUCKING HATE that movie. my girlfriend begs me to take her to the house they filmed that movie in since it’s in Cleveland. i refuse.
November 10th, 2011 at 4:18 PM
No man, Bad Santa is a movie you have to see unedited.
this is true. but at the very least… watch it on xmas eve.
November 10th, 2011 at 4:19 PM
Kid: Your beard’s not real.
Willie: No Shit!It was real, but I got sick and all the hair fell out.
Kid: How come?
Willie: I loved a woman who wasn’t clean.
Kid: Mrs. Santa?
Willie: No it was her sister
November 10th, 2011 at 4:23 PM
Okay okay okay. If it sucks though… well… I don’t have anything I can threaten with, but I’ll move you down a couple ranks in my list of invisible friends.
Where am I now? Top 25?
November 10th, 2011 at 4:23 PM
i FUCKING HATE that movie. my girlfriend begs me to take her to the house they filmed that movie in since it’s in Cleveland. i refuse.
I don’t think you have a soul. There I said it.
November 10th, 2011 at 4:24 PM
No man, Bad Santa is a movie you have to see unedited.
I own the unrated version. It’s even better than the theater version.
November 10th, 2011 at 4:25 PM
Yep!!
Badder Santa is the best version.
November 10th, 2011 at 4:26 PM
it’s a christmas eve tradition with my brother and I, and usually involves quite a bit of beer.
November 10th, 2011 at 4:28 PM
it’s a christmas eve tradition with my brother and I, and usually involves quite a bit of beer.
Drinking during Bad Santa is a must.
November 10th, 2011 at 4:32 PM
Depending on how good Bad Santa is, will determine if you end the year above or below the Christmas Card Line.
November 10th, 2011 at 4:34 PM
Didn’t some cable network start doing a 24-hour marathon of National Lampoon’s Christmas Vacation? That’s a much better option than ‘A Christmas Story’.
/Hallelujah, holy shit, where’s the Tylenol?
November 10th, 2011 at 4:36 PM
Depending on how good Bad Santa is, will determine if you end the year above or below the Christmas Card Line.
Well honestly, if you don’t like Bad Santa, I don’t know how good of friends we can be.