Randy Moss, Game Changer Extraordinaire and Sure Hall of Famer
Randy Moss is a sure Hall of Famer. There is some discussion about whether he will be a first ballot Hall of Famer, but I’m not going to get caught up in that lest I get too angry–all that first ballot stuff can be political.
Where does he rank in the pantheon of receivers? For me, once you split out the absolute best of two completely different types of football–Jerry Rice and Don Hutson, Randy Moss is next. Moss, TO, and Harrison are all among the top ten of all-time. Moss may not have been as multi-faceted as the other two, as Marvin was a technician and TO was an all-around physically dominant force. Moss, though, was the game changer, the irresistable force that changed how the other team had to play the entire offense.
I always bristle a little at talk about players being one-dimensional. It irked me when it was said of Derrick Thomas, and it irks when it is said of any player who simply did something better than anyone else. No doubt, by the end of Randy’s career, he was little more than a guy who ran “9″ routes. But the most one-dimensional players in this game–the quarterbacks–get the most attention. It’s about how much value toward winning you create, star quarterbacks do it, and Moss did it in droves.
He was the key driver in the two highest scoring offenses of all-time, separated by a decade, teams that lost on last second heartbreak in the playoffs. For his entire career, in games he played, his teams averaged 24.5 points in the 197 regular season games he played, including that Oakland stint and his time standing mostly on the sidelines in Tennessee last year.
The year before he arrived in Minnesota, the Vikings were a solid playoff team with a good offense, 22.1 points a game. They became a juggernaut in 1998 with the only offensive changes being Randy and Randall Cunningham in place of Brad Johnson–34.75 points a game. In New England, the Patriots with Tom Brady went from a healthy 24.1 points per game to the unprecedented 36.8 points a game, with the only changes being the loss of Corey Dillon and the additions of Randy and Wes Welker.
Just doing some back of the envelope rough calculations (since we don’t know how each specific team would have done without Moss as roster construction changed), and using the year before he arrived in Minnesota, Oakland, and New England as baselines, teams were about +2.5 points a game better with him. That probably understates it, because Minnesota declined in personnel over his tenure there (from Green to Tice, Cris Carter, Randall McDaniel retiring, Korey Stringer’s untimely death) and Oakland became a dumpster fire that brought Art Shell and a bed and breakfast owner on board.
The average for all offensive Hall of Famers was +1.8 points above average over their careers–and that includes Quarterbacks, who contributed more valuable. Whether you look at his own receiving numbers, or the impact on the offenses overall while he was in the game, he was substantially more valuable than the average offensive non-QB in the Hall of Fame–even with that lost Oakland year and last season’s debacle.
Absolutely take that time in Oakland into account. Just don’t overweigh it. You would have to assign about 100 times more importance to that season than any other to justify leaving him out of the Hall. Yes, he quit on that team. Geniuses sometimes don’t handle incompetence of others very well, and that pretty accurately captures that situation. It’s not like that team was making the playoffs.
We had to deal with the questions with Terrell Owens, and I’m sure with Moss as well. My guess: the five-year delay actually causes the way it all ended in 2011 to fade, people recognize how dominant he was, and he will be a no-brain choice.
Straight to Canton, Homie.
[photo via Getty]

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117 Responses to “Randy Moss, Game Changer Extraordinaire and Sure Hall of Famer”
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August 2nd, 2011 at 4:06 PM
Straight to Canton, Homie
Indeed. Though the memories of T.O. catching like an alligator in S.F. are just as vivid for me today as they were in 2000.
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:07 PM
No brainer.
I also don’t think he will come back like Favre did. I really think the dude is done.
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:07 PM
AMEN!
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:07 PM
Glad you mentioned Mike Tice, no one should forget how horrible he was.
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:08 PM
HOFer no doubt.
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:08 PM
I am still pissed that the Vikings traded him for a bag of peanuts.
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:10 PM
A matchup of Deion vs Moss in their prime would be delicious. Wonder who would come out on top?
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:10 PM
I still cringe thinking of the shitshow that was the Vikings when he was on the sidelines.
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:11 PM
i view Moss like Shaq …. he’ss an all-time great, but he could have been so much better.
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:11 PM
I felt violated just being a fan of the Packers after his first game against them on MNF…there was always a sense of sheer terror when the Viking quarterback whoever it was (Cunningham, Jeff George and then Culpepper) would step up in the pocket and have time to launch one knowing he was out there
That’s one helluva HOF class if you’re starting off with Favre and Moss
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:12 PM
Troy Williamson?
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:12 PM
This post needs more of this.
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:14 PM
I would vote Randy just for the height and jumping ability. Deion would be able to keep pace with him, but I don’t think he could elevate like Randy could.
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:15 PM
Lisk – Where does Al Toon rank your in your Top 10 WRs ever?
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:15 PM
He was my Iverson in the NFL. Still shocked he’s retired. Not convinced he’s done just yet.
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:17 PM
this is fucked.
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:17 PM
Why wouldn’t the Ravens make a call? They still planning on getting by with the likes of Derrick Mason and TJ Houscvhsgsfghswf?
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:17 PM
im voting bo jackson trucking them both on a toss.
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:18 PM
THAT IS JUST A DISGUSTING ACT!
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:19 PM
I think that a bag of peanuts would have been better to the team over Troy Williamson
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:19 PM
Drops Mason was cut and I don’t think TJ is still there.
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:20 PM
He heard I was gonna draft him in the late 2nd round again this year, therefore he promptly retired.
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:20 PM
Agree, at least the bag of peanuts could have made one fan happy.
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:21 PM
I think that a bag of peanuts would have been better to the team over Troy Williamson
Remember that game against Denver when he dropped that wide open pass?
It alone summed up his whole career.
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:22 PM
i think i remember one with jacksonville involved…either he was on the jags or playing them. but it was bad.
still though, braylon edwards takes the cake for wide, WIDE open droppiness. all hail queen braylon, vizier droppler3000.
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:23 PM
Probably my favorite Moss touchdown ever. The Dallas guy has the angle, doesn’t matter. Moss leaves him in the dust. Unreal. “He is incredible!”
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:23 PM
I liked how there was excuse after excuse on why he had lobster arms. He was just plain bad.
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:24 PM
Anquan Boldin is still there, but not much else. I see even more 2 yard dump offs to Rice in their future…
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:25 PM
All you have to do is search Troy Williamson on YouTube and you get nothing but “Troy Williamson sucks,” “Troy Williamson can’t catch,” etc
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:26 PM
Depends. Does Deion just have to cover, or is he expected to cover and tackle?
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:26 PM
The Bears only had one guy that even slowed Moss down when he was in Minnesota. Mike Brown laid a couple hits on Moss that made him a little more uneasy, but Randy absolutely TORCHED the likes of Tony Parrish, Barry Minter, Walt Harris, RW McQuarters and Jerry Azumah.
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:26 PM
just fucking awful. I remember giving the WTF? as soon as they drafted him in the first fucking round.
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:27 PM
Randy Moss made teams draft to defend him. That alone should tell you that he is a first ballot HOFer but his attitude and behavior will keep him out the first year or 2.
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:28 PM
That afro will never stop be awesome.
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:28 PM
David Terrell. Yet another Michigan product was quite adept at dropping passes at the worst possible time.
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:28 PM
im voting bo jackson trucking them both on a toss.
When Moss was at FSU, he ran a 4.25 40, Deion ran a 4.23. Are you saying Bo was faster? If so, that’s just unreal.
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:28 PM
If not more, considering Cris Carter is still not in
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:29 PM
I think Darren Sharper was made Randy’s personal bitch on the most occasions though.
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:29 PM
Ark -
This is fucker because it is happening to me right now… 111. I think 114 is the all time high and it is only 3:30.
http://forecast.weather.gov/MapClick.php?site=top&zmx=1.0416666666666667&zmy=1.0416666666666667&map.x=320&map.y=149
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:30 PM
he ran an unofficial 4.12 at the 1986 combine at 230 lbs.
/according to that highlight clip about halfway thru
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:30 PM
At least Charles Rodgers was pretty good till he broke his collar bone. Twice. Then got high.
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:30 PM
This. He changed the league.
He had no chance from day 1. You can’t seriously draft a guy (a stretch of a pick no less) and tell him, “You’re going to replace Randy effing Moss” and expect that to work out.
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:30 PM
what always blew me away about moss was his ability to make catches in stride, running full out in a fade pattern and his ability to make a spectacular catch look simple. it looked so effortless, graceful.
that game winner against the jets in 2008, corner of the end zone, fingertip grab, toes anchoring him to the turf as he falls OB for the TD.
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:30 PM
I feel your pain, ark. It’s 111 here. Fortunately, I haven’t been outside since about 8am.
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:31 PM
EWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWW!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:31 PM
My god…
/didn’t Vick run close to a 4.2 40 in the combine as well?
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:31 PM
The top of the ’99 Packer draft was pretty hysterical
1) CB – Antuan Edwards (oof was he bad)
2) CB – Fred Vinson (never really knew if he’d have been good, Packers traded him for Ahman Green and he immediately blew out his knee)
3) CB – Mike McKenzie (hey, 1/3 ain’t bad)
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:33 PM
You guys and your hot ass weather. I’m happy it rarely gets over 95 at the hottest around here. It’s usually between 50-80 degrees year around.
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:33 PM
s1rweeze duckworthing his own video from yesterday.
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:34 PM
If Kolb can even be half of what Daunte was in Minny, think Larry Fitz can approach Moss’ level of greatness? Dre Johnson? Megatron?
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:34 PM
AWW! Cute!
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:35 PM
a damn outrage.
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:35 PM
amateurs.
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:35 PM
Broccoli: Rain actually made the Hungarian GP one of the most entertaining races of the season.
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:35 PM
Depends. Does Deion just have to cover, or is he expected to cover and tackle?
Come on now, Deion never tackles. He was the best pure cover corner I’ve seen; better than Revis or Nnamdi.
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:36 PM
To be fair, that comment got stuck in moderation hell for most of the day. Besides that highlight is that good
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:36 PM
Yes.
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:36 PM
Fitz had Kurt fucking Warner man. And Boldin on the other side. Fitz peaked already.
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:36 PM
I’d put T.O. ahead of Moss, myself. And I’d also put Andre Reed over Al Toon.
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:37 PM
I’m team warm 100%, so I hate bitching. it’s the complete lack of rain that gets me.
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:37 PM
if kolb can be 3/4 what warner was Fitz will be golden.
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:37 PM
Too much football talk happening in a football thread for you?
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:37 PM
Fitz actually gives a shit though.
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:38 PM
I actually read through that thread late last night and I saw it. I’ll read any thread about wide-recievers to see if Jerry Rice comes up.
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:38 PM
ha. He is 27. That is entering your prime. His off year with Max Hall and horseballs throwing to him mounted to 90 catches 1100 yrds and 6tds. He is far from peaked.
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:39 PM
taking a look at that 2005, it was quite the poo poo platter of shitty selections.
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:39 PM
Yeah, it actually did. Watching it, I could see how that race is normally one of the worst. There really isn’t any space to do anything at all and if you get any time in between cars, they aren’t making it up.
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:39 PM
I’m just bored. Football just got back and you’re already arguing about the same shit. Plus, baby foxes are super cute. I also read an update about the doe and her two fawns that were found living in Lakeview.
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:39 PM
I’m team warm 100%, so I hate bitching. it’s the complete lack of rain that gets me.
I’m on Team Warm as well, but 110+ takes it to beyond comfortable into suffocating. We had quite a bit of rain this summer until the middle of July and now the world is brown.
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:39 PM
/didn’t Vick run close to a 4.2 40 in the combine as well?
4.2 sounds like a Virginia Tech time. He was like 4.35 at the combine
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:39 PM
TO had an attitude problem too, was a freak physically, but in sheer talent far from what moss was.
the fact that TO is even considered close to Moss is a shame considering if Moss applied himself as much as TO did we’d be talking about Moss as the equivalent to Jerry Rice or better than him.
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:40 PM
Iggles signed Run Ronnie Run. I didn’t mean Fitz peaked physically. Yeah, he is entering his prime but I just don’t think he will put up the same numbers like he did with Warner and those other weapons.
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:40 PM
I’m so happy I don’t spend my summers in Arkansas anymore. That shit is oppressive.
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:40 PM
Was this really necessary?
/sadface
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:41 PM
We hit 118 in June. Now that is hot but it has been nice these last couple of days. Monsoon season kicks ass.
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:41 PM
Thanks, had a friend arguing he ran a 4.2. Needless to say, as much as I am a fan of Vick, no way he ran a 4.2.
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:41 PM
Make no mistake, I’m heavily on team warm over team cold. I’m just not on team motherfucking heatstroke!
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:41 PM
nice job, Lisk.
Ronnie Brown to the EAGLES! I mean, to the Miami Heat
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:42 PM
Ronnie Brown?
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:42 PM
T.O. in his prime was like trying to tackle a clydesdale. Almost unstoppable after the catch.
Settle down.
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:42 PM
This as well. I think Fitz already has better playoff numbers than Moss ever put up.
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:43 PM
good thing he’ll be playing the run stopping DL and LB positions the eagles need.
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:43 PM
Pipe down with your dry heat.
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:44 PM
@SG,
Walking the dog last night we saw a pair of fawns with mom. They live in the woods right behind our house.
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:44 PM
Team cold all the way. You can always put on a jacket. I feel for all of you going through this head. It’s been between 78-85 pretty much all summer here.
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:44 PM
Agreed. He’s in the Deion category in terms of raw athletic ability.
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:44 PM
You’re definitely right about that. I wanted them to take Derrick Johnson.
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:45 PM
all i’m saying is, Moss was physically gifted beyond what his contemporaries were/are, if he applied the effort of a guy like TO to his talents we’d be talking about a career with stats far beyond what he actually posted.
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:45 PM
Whooooa, settle down is right. Step away from the keyboard.
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:46 PM
Buy low opportunity…needed a backup to Shady anyway.
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:46 PM
this is fucked.
I feel your pain, ark. It’s 111 here.
amateurs.
Pipe down with your dry heat. Triston
/high fives!
//falls down and has a heat stroke.
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:46 PM
Why would people run against a team with Nnamdi, Asanta, and Rodgers-Cromartie? How could you even predict such a thing? If that was a possibility, I’m sure the Eagles staff could have predicted and readied for that scenario.
I still think the Jets have better corners.
/hates Asante
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:47 PM
Fuck all of this. I fucking love snow so much. I might be black and from Arkansas but I can’t stand the heat. A 60-65 degree autumn day is perfection.
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:48 PM
TO was fucking awesome…he did things like run routes (albeit not at an elite level) and block that moss wouldn’t even TRY to do.
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:48 PM
23 days, 11 hours, 9 minutes until Spa.
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:50 PM
SG’s kittens in 3 years.
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:50 PM
I still think the Jets have better corners.
/hates Asante
I just saw something on the President CB’s twitterboard the other day that said he was the best CB in football last year
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:52 PM
Let’s not mistake this…Moss put in the work in the offseason. We saw the best Moss there could be, just not on every play.
His numbers could have been better, but we saw the best Moss there was.
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:52 PM
I am pumped to watch that race, I will be glued to the tv. Are you going to try and catch the race in Austin next year?
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:52 PM
That was pretty funny! Kitten = adorable
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:52 PM
he did things like run routes (albeit not at an elite level) and block and intentionally drop passes just because he didn’t like the QB that moss wouldn’t even TRY to do
Everything in 3s
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:54 PM
Vikings cut Bryant McKinnie.
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:54 PM
I’d like to think I will be able to go. It is quite a way’s away from L.A. I hope it get’s moved out of the summer, though. I hear Austin is hot in June.
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:55 PM
Hey Ballz, I watched 5 minutes of the Hungarian GP the other day.
/just be happy it was 5.
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:56 PM
that’s the rub. not all the plays he didn’t try as hard with were blocking or decoy routes
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:58 PM
Same thing here, it’s a ways to go. Our work has an office out there, so there could be a SLIGHT, yet VERY SLIGHT, chance I could have something work related going on and at least get out there for free but most likely that won’t happen. That would be pretty cool to check out in person though.
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:58 PM
Good for you! Next race we’ll try and get it up to 10.
August 2nd, 2011 at 4:59 PM
Not a race fan? Those cars are rockets on wheels, it’s awesome. I’ve only watched about 4 races now and I’m hooked. Way more strategy and technology than any racing here in the States.
August 2nd, 2011 at 5:00 PM
It was a Sunday afternoon and I was flipping through the channels during commercials of White Sox-Red Sox game on TBS.
August 2nd, 2011 at 5:02 PM
Watch the one at Spa, that’s going to be a great race. Ballz was showing me some youtube videos about the track and from prior races there, great track.
August 2nd, 2011 at 5:04 PM
I understand…My point was more that he worked hard at his craft to be ready to play. His situation is different than Shaq’s (as he was earlier compared to) because Shaq was often out of shape, and we don’t know what his true ceiling was…we have an accurate depiction of how good Randy Moss could be.
August 2nd, 2011 at 5:27 PM
Greatest WR’s ever:
1. Jerry Rice
2. T. Owens
3. John Taylor
4. Dwight Clark
5. Gene Washington
6. JJ Stokes
7. Randy Moss
/Ballz
August 2nd, 2011 at 5:37 PM
Needs more Rashuan Woods
August 2nd, 2011 at 5:43 PM
Where’s Merton Hanks?
August 2nd, 2011 at 5:48 PM
In the endzone doing his chicken head dance
August 2nd, 2011 at 5:53 PM
YES! I was hoping for that response.
/remembers his childhood fandom of the Niners
August 2nd, 2011 at 6:01 PM
Fuck yes, one of my favorite Niners just for that alone. Him and his white turtleneck against that red jersey…
/wipes tear