Derrick Rose Isn’t Afraid Of The Boston Celtics
Derrick Rose made Rajon Rondo and the Celtics look silly last night as he scored 30 and handed out 8 assists in a 97-81 Bulls victory. If the Bulls and Celtics meet in the playoffs, it won’t be until the Eastern Conference Finals, but if both teams make it that far, Rose and the Bulls aren’t worried. At least not since the Celtics traded Kendrick Perkins.
Via Adrian Wojnarowski:
“He was tough,” Rose said. “We could defend on someone that was big. He was really tough to go around. … They’re different.”
Different doesn’t mean better. It means diminished. The Bulls beat the Celtics 44-22 in the paint, beat them badly on the boards, too. They assailed the Celtics the way the Celtics used to assail everyone else.
“We know we can beat them,” Rose flatly said.
So all the Bulls have to worry about now is LeBron James, Dwyane Wade and Dwight Howard. No big deal.
[Yahoo!]
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April 8th, 2011 at 11:35 AM
John Hollinger has him SIXTH (!) on his MVP ballot.
This is why I think the majority of stat geeks in basketball are morons, they’re so hard headed about analysis of data that they ignore or disregarded the impact of the player when you actually watch them play. Not everything in basketball is measurable, and though of course stats are useful, it doesn’t paint the whole story. Rose, at the least, should be 3rd. I’m intrigued to know who else he thinks is more valuable other than Howard and Lebron.
April 8th, 2011 at 11:36 AM
And I said it before, and I’ll say it again:
The Perkins trade was a huge mistake.
April 8th, 2011 at 11:37 AM
So all the Bulls have to worry about now is LeBron James, Dwyane Wade and Dwight Howard.
So this was the real Heatles before they opted to go with RuPaul?
April 8th, 2011 at 11:38 AM
MVP this year is an interesting award because there really isn’t one player completely carrying his team other than Rose (whose team isn’t completely devoid of talent) and Howard.
I think had the Knicks kept pace, Amare would have made some sense and every playoff team in the West is an actual team, not one guy willing his team to victory.
Just kind of a strange year for the MVP.
April 8th, 2011 at 11:39 AM
Everybody at the time the trade happened thought it was a bad move except for Danny Ainge.
April 8th, 2011 at 11:39 AM
I will say though that the way Boston is slumping, I see the Heat gaining momentum and making it to the NBA Finals. I don’t know if the Bulls can beat the Heat in a 7 game series. Of the regular season wins, I’m pretty sure Lebron wasn’t playing in one game, and in the other one, Bosh shot 1-18 and that’s not happening very often.
April 8th, 2011 at 11:39 AM
If their overall goal this season is to lose to the Lakers, then yes.
April 8th, 2011 at 11:40 AM
Specifically remember SJ and maybe one or two more guys on here saying Perkins impact was hollow and it wouldn’t make much of a difference to the C’s.
April 8th, 2011 at 11:40 AM
The Celtics will still be there at the end, my hope is that they need 7 grueling games against the Heat first
April 8th, 2011 at 11:41 AM
to which my response was – if you’re going to rely on SHAQ (of all people) being healthy at 39 years old then your team is in trouble.
April 8th, 2011 at 11:41 AM
Bulls just better bring it on Tuesday. They might not get another chance to be amde famous in the Mecca this year.
April 8th, 2011 at 11:42 AM
It blows my mind why people get so angry at people who use data as the basis for their opinions. What is the big deal? It is just a different way of looking at something, not quite sure why you’re so offended
April 8th, 2011 at 11:42 AM
The Perkins trade was a huge mistake.
Everybody at the time the trade happened thought it was a bad move except for Danny Ainge.
Only because they were betting on the O’Neals getting and staying healthy — which given their injury histories and the general weight Shaq carries around is insane.
April 8th, 2011 at 11:42 AM
I said it. And my reasoning was that they had been pretty good all year with Perk being injured for most of it.
April 8th, 2011 at 11:42 AM
That crossover was sick.
Tim Hardaway even approves.
April 8th, 2011 at 11:43 AM
Why? They’ll either clinch home court tonight or Sunday in Orlando against what’s left of the Magic and then will finally be able to rest their guys…suppose there’s still a chance the Spurs could lose out leaving the door open for the #1 overall but I doubt it
April 8th, 2011 at 11:43 AM
How dare people use statistics to back up their points! My eye test is the only proper way to judge MVP talent.
April 8th, 2011 at 11:44 AM
I want to be kind of validated when I come in screaming “THREE AND OH!” in your faces on Wednesday. It’s the little things.
April 8th, 2011 at 11:44 AM
Agreed, it always become an either/or thing when like most things analyzing a player should be a meshing of both
April 8th, 2011 at 11:44 AM
This would be Fucking Great!!!
April 8th, 2011 at 11:44 AM
I don’t know. The Bulls match up with the Heat better than the Heat do to the Bulls.
April 8th, 2011 at 11:45 AM
Because the ones who are really ingrained in using it act as if its the end-all be all for basketball discussions. Rose can’t be the MVP – why? Cause his PER or his eFG or whatever else formula they’ve cooked up is crappy. Yet, I watch the guy play, and its very clear the impact he has on his team. So either Rose-supporters must be blind, or the stat guys are just more knowledgeable than all of us because they can point to box scores and formulas.
April 8th, 2011 at 11:45 AM
Aaand Jon Krasinski representing!
April 8th, 2011 at 11:46 AM
They still should attempt to hold off LA from getting homecourt from them.
April 8th, 2011 at 11:46 AM
Please God, I don’t ask for much, let the Bulls meet the Knicks in the playoffs…
April 8th, 2011 at 11:46 AM
we got ourselves all asian leaders at augusta!
/hauls ass to benihana’s
April 8th, 2011 at 11:47 AM
Bulls just better bring it on Tuesday. They might not get another chance to be amde famous in the Mecca this year
They clinch with win in Cleveland tonite, doubt you will see any serious minutes from starters against NY.
They want to be rested from all that defense they ply and be able to take it to next level in playoffs.
/at least Knicks can say they went 3-0 against Champs
April 8th, 2011 at 11:47 AM
No stats is fine. Everyone uses stats, but my beef is with guys like Hollinger who see basketball as being defined by numbers in every way. Rose 6th on his MVP ballot pisses me off, and I don’t even like the Bulls or care for Rose much.
April 8th, 2011 at 11:48 AM
I enjoyed his comments when asked about the MVP.
April 8th, 2011 at 11:48 AM
April 8th, 2011 at 11:48 AM
I don’t know if the Bulls can beat the Heat in a 7 game series.
I do. The Bulls have a better PG and a stronger inside game. The Heat will basically be asking Dwayne and LeBron to go for 30+ every game of the postseason in order to advance.
let the Bulls meet the Knicks in the playoffs
If the Knicks face the Heat in the first round, who is in a better position to advance?
April 8th, 2011 at 11:48 AM
Statistics (advanced and otherwise) should be regarded as data points that could be used towards drawing a logical conclusion. They shouldn’t preclude the use of observation. They should compliment it, and hopefully, help explain it.
April 8th, 2011 at 11:49 AM
He will be accepting his award by throwing a bounce pass over a Kia.
April 8th, 2011 at 11:50 AM
They’re up three games on the Lakers, they take care of business tonight and Sunday and Tuesday still doesn’t matter…just depends on if the Spurs lock up the top spot by then
April 8th, 2011 at 11:51 AM
Statistics tell me that Cory Maggette is a great player. My “eye test” tells me he’s not very good.
Statistics tell me that Shawn Marion is a great option in crunch time – in the top 10 even. My “eye test” tell me that the only way he scores in crunch time are wide open kickouts or cleanup buckets around the hoop.
The two don’t have to be mutually exclusive. I’m not a complete “eye” guy, stats are very important – but people like Abott and Hollinger put more emphasis on it than watching the games.
April 8th, 2011 at 11:52 AM
As a college football fan I’m comfortable with a little eye test, a touch of regional pride combined with preconceived notions, and topped off with some SEC speeeed to determine greatness.
April 8th, 2011 at 11:52 AM
That commercial sums up nicely why people hate New York sports fans.
April 8th, 2011 at 11:52 AM
Alec Baldwin > Krasinski
It’s not even really close, either.
April 8th, 2011 at 11:55 AM
I can’t believe this is legit PJ’s last season (atleast with the Lakers).
He let reporters know of a somewhat funny exchange between Kobe and MJ from the 2001 season, which I thought was kinda cool.
April 8th, 2011 at 11:55 AM
The problem with using stats only is that stats can be skewed by stats chasers.
April 8th, 2011 at 11:56 AM
Because every eye test that you use for Rose applies to Chris Paul who plays for a worse team and in tougher circumstances. And because there are more deserving candidates. The rebuttal I get to this is always just “No” and “They aren’t the 1 seed.”
April 8th, 2011 at 11:56 AM
30 points on 16 shots? That’s incredible, and also why pro-Rose people can’t believe not everyone is on the bandwagon.
/Of course, the “geeks” see that he’s only shot this well 3 times this season.
/Howard’s done it 24 times.
April 8th, 2011 at 11:57 AM
Truth.
April 8th, 2011 at 11:57 AM
I dont see what Peyton has to do with this.
/heyooo
April 8th, 2011 at 11:58 AM
This is the single dumbest comparison of the two players I have ever seen.
April 8th, 2011 at 11:59 AM
I’ve never said Paul isn’t deserving of MVP consideration. Of course he is, but the reason he doesn’t have the buzz of Rose is because MVP consideration is only given to players with teams in the Top 3 seeds of each conference. Does Paul deserved to be mentioned in consideration for MVP in its true definition? Sure. Based on the media definition and the precedent they’ve set over the years? No.
April 8th, 2011 at 11:59 AM
Agreed, Derrick Rose should be chastised for not being 9 inches taller
April 8th, 2011 at 12:00 PM
There’s a reason in his prime Shaq was more valuable than Jason Kidd.
/sad but true
April 8th, 2011 at 12:01 PM
You’ve never said it, but I got LAMBASTED the other day for even bringing up this idea, which is why I, as a guy that likes to use the eye test and stats, get frustrated with the Pro-Rose crowd who tells me that I shouldn’t take those numbers for what they are. I think it’s kind of clear when you watch Paul play and then look at the metrics used to explain what he means to his team, he has more than enough claim in the MVP argument. But that’s just me.
April 8th, 2011 at 12:01 PM
One is a low-block player who scores mostly off dunks and hooks close to the basket. The other is a PG who has to create his own shot and scores most of the points for his team through drives and jumpers. How do you compare the FG% of a center to that of a PG?
April 8th, 2011 at 12:01 PM
Boom.
April 8th, 2011 at 12:03 PM
Of course he means a lot to his team, that team would be exceptionally shitty without him. But unless you’re Top 3, you will not get MVP props at all. It’s just the way of the league. That’s more of a problem with the league not providing a definition of MVP rather than a problem with stats/eyes.
April 8th, 2011 at 12:03 PM
He said Shaq, not Patrick Ewing.
April 8th, 2011 at 12:03 PM
Cool. As soon as the NBA becomes figure skating, and we add a degree of difficulty, I will grant you that Rose is more valuable than Dwight.
April 8th, 2011 at 12:04 PM
Because there are SOOOO many of those guys out there capable of doing this.
April 8th, 2011 at 12:05 PM
at this point I just hope DRose wins it so jersey can cry about it…
April 8th, 2011 at 12:05 PM
Was gonna ask if Dwight gets any knocks for his team being scared to give him the ball at the end of close games but suppose the same was true for Shaq…I still say he can win it and I’d be fine with it
April 8th, 2011 at 12:05 PM
How is it any different from you being hard-headed with your “opinions” or “eye test”? It’s exactly the same thing. What you see with your eyes – and are SO convinced is true – may be completely different from what someone else does.
April 8th, 2011 at 12:06 PM
Kidd had Joumana’s tits on display routinely. He was more valuable.
April 8th, 2011 at 12:06 PM
Which is fine. But there are people here, in this very thread that we converse with that refuse to give Paul his props.
April 8th, 2011 at 12:07 PM
I hope Dwight wins it so Derrick has even further motivation going into the playoffs. Dwight would be plenty deserving of the award, too.
April 8th, 2011 at 12:07 PM
Who says Paul isn’t good? I’d shit bricks if he ever ends up on the Knicks
April 8th, 2011 at 12:07 PM
Of course! they are a dime a dozen. I know the Suns have always had easy times of finding this type of player. It is PG’s that are notoriously hard for them to find.
April 8th, 2011 at 12:08 PM
who? paul is great but rose is better
April 8th, 2011 at 12:08 PM
I’m not hard headed about it, the use of statistics makes sense to me, and I think its great for the game in moderation. As someone said here before, statistics (advanced and otherwise) should be used as supplements to observing the game, not the other way around.
April 8th, 2011 at 12:08 PM
A dunk/lay-up = 2 points.
A jumper inside the 3-point line = 2 points.
What does it matter if a player scores all his points from the low-block…they’re still worth 2 points.
Why is Dwight Howard penalized because he scores easier than Derrick Rose? This part of the argument literally makes no sense.
April 8th, 2011 at 12:08 PM
Yea but that was only if the swelling from her face was able to go down in time for game time.
April 8th, 2011 at 12:08 PM
I won’t cry about it. If anything, I’ll go look at my belt that is living proof that I am more right than you when it comes to sports.
/Belt
April 8th, 2011 at 12:09 PM
You see. This, this right here is that hard hitting analysis that will get from Derpity derp Rose supporters.
April 8th, 2011 at 12:10 PM
Man, their son’s head was HUGE
April 8th, 2011 at 12:10 PM
At no point have I said Dwight doesn’t deserve the award. Actually, I’m rooting more for Dwight to win than I am for Rose – my problem was just with Hollinger’s ranking.
And Howard scoring around the hoop is not easy, no, but comparing the FG% of a PG and a center to put the PG down doesn’t make much sense.
April 8th, 2011 at 12:10 PM
>:O
April 8th, 2011 at 12:11 PM
Nobody said he isn’t. I’m just saying that in this months long MVP debate we’ve been having, I can give multiple reasons why Paul would deserve the MVP over Rose, but no one ever brings up the fact that he should.
April 8th, 2011 at 12:13 PM
You should really pray that the Knicks meet the Bulls in the playoffs. I have the wager of all wagers for that series. I don’t want to waste it on anything less than some good, old fashioned blood feuding.
April 8th, 2011 at 12:13 PM
I wasn’t penalizing him. I think it was Rusty who mocked Rose for shooting over 50% for only the 3rd time this season, when Howard has done it 24 times. Well, that comparison doesn’t make sense because Howard scores most of his points being the closest to the basket at all times while Rose creates his own shot from the 3 point line down.
I don’t get why Rose should be put down for not shooting the percentages of a center.
April 8th, 2011 at 12:13 PM
if rose was on the knicks you’d be saying the same thing and you’d probably have more to celebrate than FINALLY making the playoffs and beating the bulls twice this season.
April 8th, 2011 at 12:14 PM
To clarify, I meant they simply play what their positions ask of them. Its an unfair comparison.
April 8th, 2011 at 12:14 PM
Woah woah woah. Who the hell is calling Drose a PG. It is undersized SG around these parts.
/spits
*clink*
April 8th, 2011 at 12:14 PM
im more interested in this than any game…
April 8th, 2011 at 12:14 PM
Because those of us that are derpity derp derp Bulls fans really gave up caring about the MVP weeks ago when these threads became recycled content and everyone chasing their tails.
We, like D-Rose, just want to win. All the accolades necessary come with winning. Winning gets you everything. I said on Monday that you, of all people, should understand this as a Yankee fan.
April 8th, 2011 at 12:15 PM
But he’s not. And I don’t. So fuck you.
April 8th, 2011 at 12:16 PM
I can’t take this seriously from a “Bulls fan” who self admittedly said he didn’t watch most of their games when they sucked. So blow me.
April 8th, 2011 at 12:17 PM
so bulls fans are comparable to yankee fans now? *kills self*
April 8th, 2011 at 12:18 PM
MVP doesn’t really mean anything, but its a fun discussion.
April 8th, 2011 at 12:18 PM
I don’t give a shit anymore. I think they can pretty much start printing the repeat threepeat shit. The next two months mean nothing. God hates me and the Lakers will win.
April 8th, 2011 at 12:18 PM
That’s your boy right there.
April 8th, 2011 at 12:18 PM
Haha, Jersey loves SC in Yardwork, hates him in Ballin
April 8th, 2011 at 12:18 PM
I would be more upset if Thibs didn’t get CoY than Derrick not getting MVP. CoY is a meaningless award of course, I just think Thibs is more deserving of that moniker than any other coach as opposed to Rose with the MVP.
Thibs is the reason the Bulls are good this year. They’ve bought into him. Suppose us Bulls fans should actually give Gar Forpax some credit for that one.
April 8th, 2011 at 12:19 PM
Thats because you are pro cancer.
April 8th, 2011 at 12:19 PM
It’s what they like to call “balance” in a relationship.
April 8th, 2011 at 12:21 PM
Haha. Typical Bulls fans. Not recognizing someone’s achievement just because they had a possibly terminal condition at one point. This earth needs to be cleansed of the likes of them.
April 8th, 2011 at 12:21 PM
besides the games you had shitty tickets to how many knicks games did you watch during the non playoff years?
April 8th, 2011 at 12:21 PM
Made me laugh.
I think a lot of the media is leaning towards Pop on COY.
April 8th, 2011 at 12:22 PM
You don’t watch the Devils. I don’t rip you for that. Basketball is 4th in the major sports for me. Yeah, I’m watching it because they’re good, they entertain me and it has meaning now. If it didn’t do all of that, I would barely watch the NBA as a whole.
I will never understand the cries of “bad fan” from people who say that of folks that don’t want all of their teams when their bad. I’m not a masochist. I don’t like torturing myself (other than the Cubs and they have a limit now) when I watch sports.
If there’s a buffet with prime rib and chicken nuggets, are you taking the chicken nuggets just because they remind you of being a kid or have some other nostalgic value?
April 8th, 2011 at 12:23 PM
I have no problem with this either. Still have no idea how that team rolled so easily the first half of the season.
April 8th, 2011 at 12:23 PM
Bulls were totally blowing their load on defense last night!!!
/Darrell
April 8th, 2011 at 12:24 PM
It’s hard to watch a team every game when they suck and had no promise. Not watching the Bulls from 1998-209? Acceptable. After that? Not so much, since everyone knew Rose would blow up.
April 8th, 2011 at 12:24 PM
Well I have secured you a special place in hell with John Paxson.
April 8th, 2011 at 12:25 PM
+1
April 8th, 2011 at 12:26 PM
The Ben Gordon teams were at least entertaining. That playoff series with the Wizards was enjoyable until they lost. Beating the Heat was also nice. It was pretty easy to see the ceiling was low for those teams though. Kirk and Ben couldn’t lead them to the promise land with Eddy Curry and Tyson Chandler being all busted.
April 8th, 2011 at 12:26 PM
Of course a Lakers fan would agree with this.
April 8th, 2011 at 12:27 PM
More than enough. I could tell you every shitty player that has come through and been shitty since 2004. Let me tell you, I’ve earned my stripes watching the ever expanding ball of mass that is Eddy Curry over these years. The burning of money that was Jerome James. The waste of time that was Steve Francis. They’re my first love, and they’ve been leaving a bruise on my eye for years. But I’ll never leave them.
April 8th, 2011 at 12:27 PM
I watched the game where they scored 49 points back in the dark days…I’ve earned the enjoyment of this season
April 8th, 2011 at 12:28 PM
One of the most vivid memories of my childhood when he hit that 3 pointer. In the driveway playing hoops with a friend with the game on the radio. Pax hit the 3 and we could hear the whole neighborhood erupt with cheers through open windows.
That was really cool.
April 8th, 2011 at 12:28 PM
Because I’m not a fucking self proclaimed Devils fan. And you don’t see me jumping in hockey posts acting like I know what I’m talking about when I don’t. God, Bulls fans make me so fucking angry.
April 8th, 2011 at 12:29 PM
Reason enough to stop coming to this site, got home last night and put the TV on to see the Celtics had 68 points with 5 minutes left and my first thought was “Oh noes! They’re exerting effort on defense again!”
April 8th, 2011 at 12:31 PM
Yeah, remember those like 3 years the Lakers sucked for? How did they EVER SURVIVE?!?!?!
You expect people to watch the Bulls with no Jordan? FUCKING CRAZY!?!?!
April 8th, 2011 at 12:31 PM
Yes it was a little white dove that nestled in my heart and then shit all over it and left it cold and black.
April 8th, 2011 at 12:32 PM
Not really, I followed the team through that abysmal first season post-Shaq with Chris Mihm as our starting center and Kobe being injured late in the season.
I just think if there is nothing to cheer for, you don’t need to cheer. If management can’t even cook up a decent team to compete on a nightly basis, I shouldn’t be labeled “fairweather” because I don’t religiously watch them. I’ll follow them, keep up with them and see how they’re doing, sure. But watching every game? breaking down every game? Not so much. Why commit that much time when you know the team doesn’t have anything to play for?
/ the exception to this is when you know your team has landed a spectacular rookie – I watched almost every game of the Raptors 1999 season when I discovered the joys of a rookie Vince Carter
April 8th, 2011 at 12:33 PM
My god. Smush parker! We are not winning championships!
April 8th, 2011 at 12:33 PM
Hey, some of us bought into the Ron Mercer signing following the offseason that had promised us Tim Duncan and Grant Hill
April 8th, 2011 at 12:36 PM
Yeah, and then shortly thereafter we ended up with Marcus Fizer. Iowa State fucking sucks.
April 8th, 2011 at 12:36 PM
I don’t think you understand the level of frustration that comes with having to watch Smush play basketball as a STARTING PG.
Ditto for Kwame.
April 8th, 2011 at 12:36 PM
This makes zero sense. The ‘post’ Shaq Lakers still had the best fucking player in the NBA.
April 8th, 2011 at 12:37 PM
Wait..A gaynkees fan is making fun of Lakers? Bulls fans may be a lot of things but we’re not hypocrites…
April 8th, 2011 at 12:38 PM
Wasn’t Scott Burrell a starter on that 1999 Bulls team? for the life of me, I can’t remember who the starting PG was.
April 8th, 2011 at 12:38 PM
Well I will take the reigns here then. You are all assholes.
April 8th, 2011 at 12:38 PM
You know what I do with Lakers fans tears? I use them to take care of my swass on a hot day.
April 8th, 2011 at 12:39 PM
People who root for Los Angeles sports teams are the scum of the earth.
April 8th, 2011 at 12:40 PM
Well they are mexicans.
/thats raycesss’d
April 8th, 2011 at 12:40 PM
Yes. Because the topic was loyalty to your team even when they suck. I know its tough for you to stay on topic while you need to worry about how much is the right amount of teeth to use on Rose’s cawk and all.
April 8th, 2011 at 12:40 PM
Brent Barry, Dickey Simpkins.
April 8th, 2011 at 12:41 PM
Huh? Yeah, I still followed the Lakers, when did I say I didn’t?
My “no longer following a team religiously” actually applies more to the Raptors than the Lakers. I’ve followed the Lakers progress for about 12-13 years now, but I will readily admit I initially started because of I loved watching young Kobe. Hence why I can’t blame Cavs “fans” for rooting for Miami – they are more dedicated fans of certain players than of teams.
April 8th, 2011 at 12:41 PM
Burrell I thought just played on the last championship team…want to say the starting guards for the ’99 club were Kerr and Randy Brown, shall look this up
/Does some sleuthing
Oh right, forgot Ron Harper was still on that team and they picked up Brent Barry…how’d they ever win 13 games out of 50?
April 8th, 2011 at 12:43 PM
HE LIKES 0 TEETH! wait what?
April 8th, 2011 at 12:44 PM
IDK. what were we talking about again? Ahh fuck it. Fuck the Lakers.
April 8th, 2011 at 12:44 PM
Still can’t believe the Jazz didn’t win the championship in 1999. That was thier last chance.
April 8th, 2011 at 12:45 PM
oh fuck you. you try following a team after getting your heart ripped out…it’s painful to even watch and not just because of the awful basketball.
the fans are still there…it’s the bandwagoners who came to see the circus that are gone. but regardless of your dedication…it’s just sad to watch now.
April 8th, 2011 at 12:47 PM
Wasn’t referring to you dude, I know you’re an actual Cleveland fan.
April 8th, 2011 at 12:48 PM
Go Bulls
April 8th, 2011 at 12:52 PM
Indeed
April 8th, 2011 at 12:53 PM
To assume Chicago shouldn’t worry about the Celtics in the playoffs is laughable. If Rivers really wanted that game, he wouldn’t have sat Pierce and Garnett as much in last night’s game. If you shut down Rose, the Bulls are not winning more than 1 series.
April 8th, 2011 at 12:56 PM
People who root for Los Angeles sports teams are the scum of the earth.
Good one
April 8th, 2011 at 1:12 PM
the gold is in comment 120 ty.
April 8th, 2011 at 7:11 PM
Bull’s fans sure are fair-weather. Guess the beers cold and cheap